Saturday, July 14, 2007

Salvation by Faith, the Original Decree

"Was King David along with Moses and the prophets saved? If so, how can they be saved before the arrival of Jesus?"

This question was posed to me in one of the comments left on my post James and Adrian

It is with prayer and scripture, I present this post.

From the moment God created Adam, He has consistently emphasized faith. Faith, trust, belief and obedience in them are the necessary components to be reconciled unto Him.

“And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.” Genesis 2:12

This decree, a commandment, required nothing less than obedience. It spoke of the relationship God had with Adam, and the expectation of trust, faith and belief in Him. The disobedience in the Garden of Eden was the manifestation of the absence of trust, faith and belief.


We look to Abraham, who God established His covenant with, as an example of this recurrent theme. Abraham was declared righteous by God because of his complete obedience to God’s commands.
“he (Abram) believed in the Lord; and he counted it to him for righteousness” Genesis 15:6
“For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith” Romans 4:13
“For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.” Romans 4:3

It was only after Abram was declared righteous by God, because of his faith, that God established a covenant with him.


We know the story of Moses and, how he led God’s people out of Egypt. The Hebrews struggled in the desert, to remain obedient to God. The reason for the struggle is explained in the 3rd chapter of Hebrews

“For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses. But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness?
And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not? So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.”

Additional scripture:Psalm 95:10-11


To answer the question listed above; King David, Moses, the prophets and all of those who trusted and believed God were saved! Why? Because they had faith!

Read these passages from Hebrews the 11th Chapter:
By faith the walls of Jericho fell down, after they were compassed about seven days.
By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace.
And what shall I more say? for the time would fail me to tell of Gedeon, and of Barak, and of Samson, and of Jephthae; of David also, and Samuel, and of the prophets:
Who through faith subdued kingdoms, wrought righteousness, obtained promises, stopped the mouths of lions.
Quenched the violence of fire, escaped the edge of the sword, out of weakness were made strong, waxed valiant in fight, turned to flight the armies of the aliens." 30-34

I obviously cannot reprint the whole chapter of Hebrews, which lists example after example of those who had faith and who were deemed righteous because of it. It must be your own personal decision and quest to study the word of God in full, meaning verse-by-verse. This way you can begin to receive a reasonable and correct understanding of God's word. Additional Scripture: Proverbs 1:7Proverbs 2


So why did God establish the Laws (10 commandments and temple laws)? All of these laws in the Old Testament were created to establish a full KNOWLEDGE of sin in man.

“Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall be no flesh justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.” Romans 3:20
“What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet” Romans 7:7

The laws established in the Old Testament behaved as a "mirror". It was God's way of saying, "Okay, you want to live outside of my will? Go ahead and keep all of these laws and you will obtain righteousness." Romans 8:3

Let’s look at this from a logical perspective. Everyone knows that there MUST be trust in any relationship. Anyone who has experienced distrust on their part of on the part of an beloved, knows there cannot be peaceful coexistent between two people until they have worked out trust issues.
“Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ” Romans 5:1
The way we work on our trust issues with God is through faith in Christ Jesus. God obviously does not need to work on anything as He is perfectly righteous in all He does. That responsibility falls on us.


This point is so important, it necessitates repeating. Was Kind David and the prophets saved? YES!

“But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law AND THE PROPHETS;” Romans 3:21
"Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God:” Romans3:20-23

Before Christ, the prophets were saved through the prophecy of the coming of the Messiah. They believed what God said unto salvation and their faith was counted unto them for righteousness.

Faith has always been demanded of God since the very beginning of time. The Bible is filled with examples of those who obeyed by faith and those who didn't. And the consequences they experienced because of it.

Salvation by faith was the original decree of the God, the Father of Abraham Isaac and Jacob since the beginning of time as it was known.


  1. That's the point of the whole law. Faith and love. So if a person is born in a culture and does not believe in Christianity, although does have deep faith in the Almighty Divine Source, and has transcended the ego they are also saved.

    This is why Jesus is the Anointed which means Messiah. He is the Anointed king and high priest. People were saved and were able to have a relationship with the Divine Almighty and forgiven before Jesus' arrival.

    The Christen Dogma is wrong. The Idolatry of Christianity has blinded the minds of the members.

    Yes King David was forgiven for murder and adultery directly from the Almighty Divine YHWH.

    King Saul was rejected because he was arrogant and would not listen. Keep in mind King Saul did not get involved in Idolatry.

    Even if a person believes in Jesus, although Arrogant and living in their ego and is selfish and greedy, they cannot have a close relationship with the Divine Source. It is impossible.

    Although they could still be saved during the time of the Judgment into the new earth.

  2. Enlight,

    You keep saying Jesus is the “Anointed”, which is true (in the OT), but I’ve yet to see a declaration from you that Jesus the Christ, the Anointed, the High Priest is the very Son of the Living God.

    So my question to you is this….Do you believe the Messiah, the Anointed one, the High Priest, The SAVIOR of the World to be the SON OF GOD?????

    John 3:16

  3. Of course I believe that Jesus is the Anointed one and high priest. He is my master which I am more then willing to share in his sufferings for others, which Peter talked about.

    Christianity wants the easy way out. IT's because of their faithless fear.

    Messiah and Christ means Anointed not Savior.

    The reason the Dogma of Christianity is stuck on this is because when the man of lawlessness (antichrist) arrives in the flesh he is going to make himself look like the savior of this world. Look up 2 TH 2:1-4.

    He will put himself up as God and deceive everyone. Then the children of darkness will kill all the children of light, it is through their death they will be saved into the new earth.

    There are two groups Jesus taught the little flock (chosen) and the other sheep (destine for the new earth)

    This is what Jesus taught, The way to become chosen which is transcending the ego, Get rid of all attachment, even family he teaches, give your whole-self, follow without anything in between. He also taught about the time of the end, judgment time. Of course he taught faith and love.

    There are two anointed ones the good Jesus, and the Bad, Baal (Satan). Daniel talks about two resurrections the good the new earth and the bad to a kingdom of shame, fear, guilt.

    There are also two different types of resurrections. One of the Chosen, this is to heaven, but only the few. Many called, few chosen. Then a resurrection of the ones that will be killed during the time of the man of lawlessness to the new earth.

    Jesus and his chosen take on the suffering so then the other sheep will just get a swift death and not have to suffer at the hands of men. Look up Zechariah 13: 7-9. Through their death they will be saved during the time of the man of lawlessness.

    That is what John meant about any who believes in Jesus will be saved during the time of Judgment. Saved into the new earth.

    Christianity wants the easy way out.
    This world is a bunch of sissies if you ask me. Being overcome in their faithless fear.

    The only way to see the truth is to let go of being positioned. Being positioned as a Christen puts up a road block. Then, even the wonderful book of the Bhagavad Gita will never get read, because your stuck on that Jesus saved this world or is going to?

    The world is under the power of the wicked ones.

    Jesus will return after all the children of light are dead to bring a ruin to the world of the children of darkness. Which will be a day of gloom the Prophets wrote.

    Paul said, IF any of the light are even left over they will be caught up. That is IF any are left.

    Jesus came to the earth to gather his chosen and give the example to suffer and die to get to the new heavens or new earth.

    Everyone will be tested to their death.

    It is sad to see Christianity stuck on the book of John and the writings of Paul.

  4. You still didn't answer my question...

    I asked if you believed He is the SON of GOD?

  5. It's interesting how you pick and choose books from the New Testament and then mix in your therory with secular concepts. That may explain your confusion.

    In case you missed it in scripture, Jesus saves us from a spiritual death...I never said He was going to save this world and neither does the New Testament (Which by the way, explains in the Book of Revelation, written by John)...

    Not to get off the point, I would like to know if you believe that Jesus is the SON of the LIVING GOD.

  6. Of course he is, Jesus, really his name is Yeshua translated Johsua. Jesus was the first one Created by the Almighty Divine Source of all things. Then many many other spirits were created. But Jesus was the very first one. Then Jesus shared in the creation of everything along with other spirits. This is why The Almighty Divine Father could take his spirit and put it in Mary to be born of a virgin.

    Although the ego also existed and Baal (Satan) was the first one to fall to the dark-side, because of pride and arrogance-ego driven behaviors. Halloween is a celebration of his fall to the dark-side. These Entities makes it fun, kids and candy.

    This is why Baal (Satan) will arrive in the flesh as the man of lawlessness for three in a half years.

    He is going to act like he is going to save mankind, this is why mankind is ruining this earth.

    Jesus did not come to the earth to save this world. This world is under the power of the wicked ones.

    Jesus said to be no part of this world.

    Jesus is the King and Master and high priest of the children of light. and the King of the new heavens and new earth.

    The children of light will be saved through their faith. Anybody can be saved during the man of lawlessness into the new earth. All they have to do is not believe in the man of lawlessness and don't get chipped with the RFID chip in their body which will be the mark of the beast.

    Although since nobody will be able to buy and sell at this time, it will take strong FAITH. Happy are the poor, yes they will be happy they have anything to give up. The rich will be stumbled. This is what Jesus was referring to the time of the man of lawlessness.

    Everyone will be tested because the Idolatry that in every religion on this earth.

    Christianity will not know what hit them.

  7. He saves his chosen. It is his chosen they are talking about. The very few that come out of the deception of this world and will not have anything to do with including religion.

    Yes he saves his chosen from sin and this world your right.

  8. The way you explain it, Jesus is no different than any other spirit that God created and

    ...still yet...

    I’ve not heard you declare His divinity as God’s Son. Yes, it goes without saying Jesus is called by many names. The point isn’t what He’s called, the point is that HE IS THE SON. Do you confess that He is the SON?

    I’ve yet to hear you share the good news of salvation which is what Christ commands of us.

    All I’ve heard from you thus far are your mixed theories (secular and scriptural) and condemnation of pretty much everyone. One would assume that you believe yourself to be sinless.

    I’m going to end this dialogue by declaring freely and sharing my testimony. I believe Jesus to be the Son of God in which EVERY knee will bow. Not only is He my savior and king, He is my friend. By the Holy Spirit, I walk daily with peace that surpasses all understanding. I believe the Word of God to be infallible and complete. I receive NO other doctrine or teaching that contradicts the Word.

    I would suggest to you, Enlight, to focus your studies on the Word, the whole Word and nothing but. In its ENTIRETY, that includes putting as much studying on the New Testament as you do with the Old Testament. Even then, that is not enough to understand the Wisdom of God. You need to have the right attitude towards the Word. If your focus is to use the Word to condemn others, then you are just as blind as those you accuse.

    Proverbs 1:7 “The fear of the Lord is the beginning of Wisdom, but fools despise wisdom and instruction”

  9. Well it looks like your saved.
    The good news was that Jesus was the Anointed, Suffered and Died and Rose.

    Voicing will not save anybody including yourself. Only Faith which you just wrote about.
    Only faith will save someone when the man of lawlessness (antichrist) arrives.
    Like Jesus said: woe to the person with the suckling baby. Why, because without getting chipped with the RFID you wont be able to buy and sell.

    Didi you know the national ID is coming out starting 2008 of May. Every national ID will have a RFID chip in it. Did you notice that family on Good morning America that got chipped in their arm as an experiment.

    Judaism and Christianity have hidden the truth in the western world.

    People that are trying to make money in the name of Jesus makes the Almighty sick wanting to puke the person out. Jesus condemned the people that were selling money in the temple. Jesus is the temple and people are trying to profit in his name through there Christian blogs.

    Yeah many will say did we not do this or that, Jesus will say he never knew them, workers of lawlessness.

    The dogma and organization of Christianity is blood guilty.

  10. But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

    That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

    For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

    Romans 10:8-9

    There is NO DOUBT that I am saved, in accordance to this scripture. (The Lord knows my heart)
    The question is....ARE YOU?

  11. The ego brags about oneself and wants to feel special.

    I am saved? That's something you will have to answer.

    Take care.

  12. That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

    Oh no, that's a question for the Lord.

    Read your Bible in whole and leave the secular theories where they belong. You will be a lot less confused.


Comments are moderated.

Please note the changes to this blog. ONLY respectful comments and questions are accepted. Special note to other Christians: This blog no longer caters to debate and or arguments about the Bible. If you have a comment in SUPPORT of clear and concise understanding of the saving power of Christ Jesus, you are welcome to leave comments on this blog.